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Today we’re talking about something that rarely makes the glossy retirement brochures. There’s no travel photos. There’s no fancy I’m retired memes about this. What we’re talking about is a quiet crisis that is affects a huge number of people when they retire. And that crisis is boredom and loneliness. And it’s one of the most common shocks, emotional shocks that retirees face. And it’s the one that’s also the most ignored. And I want to talk about it today. We’ve been told retirement is

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pure liberation. It’s endless golf and grandkids visits and travel and sleeping in and no boss. But it is for a lot of people, but for a lot of others, there’s a real dip that comes right after retirement, right after that honeymoon phase wears out. And that dip can turn into major problems, major depression, and it can become something a lot heavier if it’s not addressed. So today, I want to name it. I want to go through it, explain how it feels, give some examples. I want to understand why it’s

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happening and then most importantly I want to give you some tips on how you can avoid it or at least deal with it when it inevitably comes. Speaking of inevitably joining and adding levity and not being lonely, not being sad, let me bring my co-host Tony. Welcome to the show, Tony. >> Yeah. Yeah, I’m definitely not sad. >> Crisis. >> Yeah, the quiet crisis. Oh, and you’re bringing me on. There’s nothing quiet about me. Yeah, >> it’s it’s a defensive tactic to avoid

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the the boredom and loneliness of a podcast. >> Yeah. Well Well, yeah. Well, Dan, I think it’s a great topic and I I have seen it play out. I think this is such a a huge thing that people really don’t pay attention to or think about. And um a lot of people, you know, they work so hard planning to get to retirement. They don’t plan what they’re going to do. You know, some people I always say, Dan, people think I’m going to read all those book. I I love to read. I love books. I

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I’m mainly audio books these days, but I like to read and I also like to binge TV shows. And you think, wow, okay, I’ve got a lot of books I want to read. I want to binge all these shows. That’s what I’ll do in retirement. Well, that’s a really bad idea. I mean, it’s a good idea. Read books and and watch TV, but you can’t just do that uh every day all day. And uh same with golf, even though you’re getting out and at least that’s allowing for some exercise and

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socialization. You can’t do it every day throughout for, you know, most people are living what 30 years in retirement. >> You can’t golf every day for 30 years every single day. Who are you going to golf with? A lot of your friends might still be working. Right. >> Right. And and so it’s it’s a crisis that people know they it happens but people don’t talk about it. And I want to go back 50 years Tony 50 years 1976 >> Robert Aley he wrote the sociology of retirement

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and in it he mapped retirement as phases. Now, we’ve done a show, Tony, on the different phases of retirement, >> and we’ll reference some of that, but I want to focus specifically specifically on the one that most people ignored, and that’s the disenchantment phase. >> And so, what um Robert actually said is that people go through the honeymoon phase, and once that honeymoon phase is over, you get into the disenchantment phase. >> And I want to give us some numbers. And

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you know what this is? This is when you look around and say, “Is that all there is?” I mean, is this it? Uh, my structure’s gone. I was a teacher. I was a nurse. I retired. I didn’t want to have to deal with all these other people’s problems, these kids’ problems. >> Now that I’m not dealing with it, >> now it’s like I’m kind of bored, kind of lonely. And this disenchantment comes in and it’s empty. It’s depressing. And what he’s saying is in his study is that

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everyone he’s not saying that everyone crashes. He’s saying that there is this normal stage where you will go through this loneliness, depression, boredom, and that it’s natural and that you shouldn’t be surprised. And I think a lot of people are surprised. So look at the numbers, Tony. This is this is crazy. Um, UK 2024 survey found that 39% of retirees say they had to work through negative feelings like loneliness, boredom, and a reduced sense of identity or purpose. And they said uh about twothirds said

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that it hit them in the first year of retirement. A third said it showed up in the first three months. And what are the top reasons that they gave for this sense of loneliness and boredom? >> Because they were English. >> Your time. >> Oh, right. The weather. The weather. >> I mean, they’re in England. They’re English. I’m half English. My dad’s >> losing the World Cup. Um, >> but eating too much bo I mean all their food is boiled with no seasoning.

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>> You got to be careful. My f my wife’s family’s all Scottish and British. >> Oh, yeah. I’m half I’m half English. I’m 50%. So yeah, I can I can joke. >> Yeah. >> So no, the the reason why people over there in the UK said that they felt this depression in this first year is because they had too much unstructured time, no daily routine. So they in the US 2025 AP came out with a survey and said 34% of adults report feeling lonely and about one in three between ages 50 and

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80 say they feel lonely some of the time or often and that’s just the people that admit it. Think about all the people that don’t want to admit that they’re feeling that way. >> Right? So, we’re talking at least I’m going to say probably at least a third, more like half the people go through this. >> Yeah. >> And if that’s the case, why are we not talking about it? The quiet struggle. What What was the Pink Floyd lyric? Uh quiet desperation or they used or the

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British way. >> Yeah. Um so why it matters >> and you know this. >> Yeah. >> Um >> it affects your actual health, >> right? physical health is impacted by this. So, not only are you emotionally struggling, but it leads to heart disease, depression, cognitive decline. And so, what what is it that is missing? What is happening that causes this? And the the idea is that working gave us things without us knowing it. It gave us a daily structure. It gave us an identity. A lot of people have their

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identity and their status. Oh, I I have employees. I I’m important. >> And it gave them or kind of forced them to have social contact with other people. And when you retire, all those are gone. And it’s a free-for-all for a lot of people. It’s just gone. >> Yeah. And it’s a really sudden and and it turns out the people >> steep cliff. It’s a drop off of all those things. >> Huge drop off. >> Yeah. >> Especially if you get laid off or you get fired and it’s abrupt, they struggle

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even more so because they didn’t have time to to >> think about it and plan. Yeah. People don’t people aren’t thinking about it. I’m going to work another 10 years. Well, you know, that’s your plan. But it might not be, you know, because of health or because your company downsizes, you could find yourself needing to retire early, >> right? Do you do you do you have anybody that you know that retired and went through this? >> I do. I do. And I have a great example

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because I have an analogy uh with somebody who with two people. My grandfather, Grandpa Bob. Sure. English, by the way, 100%. Uh, but he lived to 101. Uh, was active through age 100 and driving, as we’ve talked about on the show. I’ve mentioned Grandpa Bob before, >> but he’s the ideal. Uh, he didn’t have health problem. He he made it. But he I grew up in a farming community and a farmer just down the road, good friends with my grandfather about the same age, him and his wife, and my grandfather and

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his wife. My grandfather outlived two wives. So, um, and, um, but this other gentleman, super nice guy, him and his wife. Um, but they sold most of their farmland. So, it’s it wasn’t a money issue, but they, uh, when they retired, uh, the difference is what they did is they they sat around a lot. They went outside and did some gardening. Uh, you know, they had a garden. That was their main hobby. They watched a lot of TV. They’d come over once in a while to Grandpa Bob’s house for they’d invite

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him over, but then as it went, nah, we’re just going to stay home. Uh, we like to watch TV. Um, they passed away very early. They maybe spent, I’m going to say less than 10 years or 10 years in retirement at most. And both, you know, the wife passed away first, but the guy, especially after his wife passed away, but even before, they just didn’t do a lot. And everybody said, “Where are they at?” Oh, they just kind of keep to themselves. And they both passed away early. And my grandfather was asked at

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his 90th, his 95th, his 99th, and his 100th birthday, the paper came out to interview him in the local TV news cuz he’s, you know, he’s driving. Uh he’s camping, he’s farming. And they said, you know, what’s your secret? And he said, you have to have a purpose to get a reason to get up every morning. And you have to keep going. And so I think that’s, you know, that’s the bottom line. >> Yeah. >> It’s huge. I remember you telling me about your dad and how he used to go

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down the street for coffee >> and when he was having some trouble with mobility >> and he had to stop doing that, >> his cognitive decline sped up. >> Oh, it sped up greatly. My own Yes. My own dad’s cognitive decline just it was a cliff. I mean, he was fine and then he couldn’t get out and socialize or work on the farm anymore or go in for co he went in for coffee every morning and there’s like 11 12 guys there that he grew up with farmers that they all went

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into the same place same time every single day. I mean every day maybe some Saturdays some of them missed but uh and Sundays but every weekday and most Saturdays and Sundays. Uh and when he couldn’t do that anymore, his cognitive decline because of physical reasons, his cognitive decline just tanked. His ability to speak, his ability to uh think rationally, and uh he went downhill fast. And a lot of people might say, oh, you know, he had the disease and that’s what caused his cognitive decline and he

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wasn’t then able to socialize with people. But in this it could be the reverse where because he couldn’t socialize with people the cognitive decline sped up rapidly >> and I don’t know I’m not a scientist I’m not a doctor but this actually’s um he had a continuity theory in 76 and he said we adapt best when we keep the meaningful pieces that we’ve always had. So when your dad retired or your grandfather retired and they didn’t just do nothing, they continued to go

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camping. They continue to meet with their friends for coffee every day. Again, structure. That was the key to maintaining some sort of continuity of the social connections. And one of the things you said just a moment ago, Tony, it wasn’t about the money for that couple. had had nothing to do with it. >> That’s you know what we do what I do I’m guilty of this is when I meet with people we’re talking about the numbers. What are you going to take social security? How much do you have in your

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IRA? Do we do a Roth conversion? How much return are we going to get? What’s your income need? How much do you spend? What are we going to do for Medicare? What’s that going to cost? Blah blah blah blah blah. All these things overwhelming, right? But people get it. They want to plan their finances. But what we’re not talking about is the soft side as a society. And I know this. I see my clients struggle after a year. And I and so I often will talk to them about things that have nothing to do

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with the money part because I know that that could money doesn’t matter. Money now money helps because it helps you sleep well at night stuff, >> right? And it helps. It’s the sleep well at night. >> So you know it’s going to be there. If I know I’m going to have enough money to last throughout 30 years of retirement and I don’t have to worry about that, that’s that’s one piece solved and I can sleep well at night, but then what about the rest? I mean, there’s so much more

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to retirement >> and and can I afford to go on the trips? Can I afford to go fly to visit my grandkids once a month? You know, and having that purpose. If you don’t have any money, then you have to do the stuff that doesn’t cost as much. Walk into town to see your friends. But so money helps, but it’s not the be all end all. So this is why it’s really important we’re talking about it today. So you said five tips. >> Okay. Purpose though. You said purpose. >> I mean that I see it with my

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grandfather. I saw it with our neighbor. Uh lack of purpose. Have have a have a purpose, a reason to get up. And that work is what kept you going during your working years. You need something like that in retirement. >> Well, that’s tip number one, Tony. Plan for purpose. I stole the thunder. >> Well, treat it like you do your portfolio, your IRA, your 401k. All right, I know what I’m going to do. I’m going to take this percentage 4% rule, blah blah blah. >> All right, fine. We can get all that,

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but before you retire, before you actually pull the trigger, what are you going to do with your time? You got to be able to answer that. >> And you don’t, and when we say purpose, you don’t need I need to rethink my whole life. I was uh, you know, a financial planner. when I retire, I’m going to have to I’m going to be a social engineer. I’m going to run for government. No, you just need what are you going to do? Like, how you going to fill your calendar? What’s your purp

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what’s your reason for getting up in the morning? And it doesn’t have to be some glorious high fluting purpose. It could be I just going to go play poker with my friends, you know, on Tuesdays. That could that could be the purpose, right? you know, you got one day covered, you know, or one one morning covered, but you need things a reason to get up in the morning and think, “Oh, tomorrow’s my poker day, or tomorrow’s book club, or tomorrow I I volunteer at the library, or I work my part-time job

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at the library or the golf course.” >> Yeah. It doesn’t have to be work is what you’re saying. You don’t have to get a second job, but >> and it doesn’t have to be grandiose. It doesn’t It could be I’m going to weed the garden on Tuesdays. That’s not going to change the world, but it mean it gives you something, right? So that’s that’s tip number one. Tip number two is protect your social world >> because workplace friends are going to fade, right? You’re friends with them

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mainly because you work with them, but like if you retire early and they’re still working, they might invite you to the happy hour or the corporate events, but after a year, you’re kind of, you know, that’s going to fade. >> Yeah. And then again, they might not. They may not, right? >> They might not invite you to the happy, >> right? And that’s a sign. It’s like, wow, that didn’t that was a forced relationship. Which is why you need to build your connections outside of your

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job so that when you do retire, you have some other group of social connections to go to. Otherwise, you leave work, you’re going to you’re either going to go back to work to go back to that social connection or you’re going to be lonely because you didn’t all your friends are working still. This happens to a lot of people that retire early or and their friends or like a a spouse will retire before they their let’s say the husband retires before the wife and he’s at home and he’s like you’re still

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working you know she’s got her work to do she’s got her friends at work and he’s like can’t you come hang out with me and it you know >> I think it’s important to build those connections outside of work >> and that takes work >> yeah right >> social interaction So does building a retirement nest egg. So does building your 401k. It takes time. Compounding interest. Do the same socially. >> It’s crazy. I know. All right. Tip number three. Create structure. We just

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we were talking about that. Keep your week busy so you don’t feel empty. You know, I I joke about my dad, you know. Hey dad, um what do you got going on next week? Uh do you want to get together on Thursday? Oh, I can’t. I can’t. Thursday. Why not? I’m going to the doctor. Okay, that’s it. Like all Thursday. >> Yeah. Yeah. I’ve got one >> appointment 10:00 a.m. Okay. Do you want to >> you want to meet later in the day? Well, I guess I could, but I mean that’s

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doctor day, right? So, >> but he’s got structure. >> Yeah. >> Right. And so, I think >> getting a few things to pick up each week is important. Uh I did a show, you can watch it. I did a bunch of interviews with different people that are retired and Diane, she did the show and she said she when she retired, she joined a softball league and now a year later she’s in three softball leagues. Who needs to be in three softball leagues? No one. Right. But then again, you got

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they one league plays on Tuesdays, one on Thursdays, one on Saturdays. So you have this, right? It’s not necessarily just about having to do the same thing over and over again. It’s filling up the days, different days with different structure. And if that makes her happy and it’s active, why not? Right. Right. Tip number four, carry your identity forward. A lot of people’s identity is based on their career. What do you do? People ask that. Tony, what do you do? I’m a voiceover

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artist. Okay. I do podcast with this guy Dan. He’s great. You retire from this. People say, what do you do? You can’t say that anymore, right? So, what can you do? If you were a employer and you had employees that you were mentoring, you can go mentor for free for other people. If you were a problem solver at work, you know, you were the person that everyone go to to fix problems. Go join a nonprofit or do some volunteer work where you’re solving problems for other people. >> You don’t have to get paid to do it, but

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what you’re doing is your identity gets to continue. >> Continue that role that makes you feel important. makes you feel like you have some value because watching the shows is fun, playing golf is fun, but does it give you that sense of identity anymore? And if not, go find something to help you feel continue that sense of identity. Yeah. Yeah. I think that’s hu I think that’s huge. Find a sense of identity uh is really hard. Your identity, you’re right, was wrapped up in what you do. Like you say, what do

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you do? Oh, I co-host a a radio show and podcast with Dan Wendell. Uh, okay. What a Once I’m once I retire. But that’s why, Dan, I can’t uh stop this. I’ll have to when I’m 70, I’ll be on here with Dan. >> Right. Right. But you you’ll be But you can mentor someone to do Oh, that sounded terrible. Read read it again. Your voice sounds like a little girl. You got to deepen the voice, Dan. Deepen the voice. >> You could do that when you’re retired. And last tip, Tony, experiment, be

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patient. We did the show on it, the five different stages it was, and one of them was the trial and error stage. So, what you do is like, I don’t know what I want to do. I hate softball. I I you know, everyone’s doing pickle ball now, right? That’s the new thing. Try it. >> But if you don’t like it, don’t be like, I got to play pickle ball because that’s what everyone’s doing. If you don’t What about botchi ball? >> Botchi. There you go. That’s the new

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craze. I hear that’s the new craze. That’s the new craze. Stay tuned for that. You could play botchi. It’s It’s better on the knees. Um Yeah. You know, um less injuries, >> but you’re right. Um you may not like something and you might want to switch. >> Try something new. Go try kayaking. Go to the library and volunteer. If you don’t like it, go to the food pantry. Go. And if you don’t like it, try something. It doesn’t mean because you do it, you have to make that your new

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thing. Try it. And then maybe after a couple years you try something new, right? The bottom line is it’s going to be an experiment because you’ve never retired before. You’ve not had free time. Typically, most people that retired don’t haven’t had this much free time since they were a teenager or even younger, right? Most people worked their whole lives and now they have all this time. It’s like, well, what do I want to do? Well, what do you want to do? So, try stuff. >> But think about it before you get there.

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>> 100%. Tony, tap back to tip, back to the whole point of this podcast. Think about this before. It’s not just about the money. It’s about your time. And don’t feel like you’re broken. I’m not a therapist or a psychologist, but just because you are feeling depressed and meaningless after retirement doesn’t mean you failed, right? >> It’s natural. >> You just need to recognize it and do something about it. >> Yeah. >> Right. That’s the key. So,

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>> expect this dip. If you’re watching, you’re like, I’m looking forward to retirement. I watch Dan’s videos. I can’t wait to take social security. I’m gonna delay social. Whatever you’re going to do, you’re planning the financials. That’s great. Now, take the time and build the social and the purpose area of your retirement plan because no one’s going to tell you to do this. the financial person is not, you know, I’m I do this, but I’m not qualified to be a life coach,

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but I know that people face it. So, I will encourage you to think about it. But if you’re planning your retirement and you’re not thinking about what you can do with your time, you’re setting yourself up for this disenchantment phase. And the less time you put into thinking about it now, the longer that disenchantment phase may last. >> Yeah. So figure it out, Tony. >> Awesome, Dan. >> And and I will say this for those that uh are on iTunes or Spotify, there’s a

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great PA album about retirement, and there’s a great song about this very topic. It’s called What Do I Do Next? Retired. What’s Next? Look it up. Listen to it. It might give you a little jump in your step to make your day brighter. >> Retirement pocas. retire poker party. >> Tony, thanks for a great show. We’ll catch everyone next week.